Water kefir

[Atash Hagmahani]

This isn't really cooking because there's no cooking going on. It's just fermentation.

I'm fermenting a batch of "water kefir" right now. It's not really kefir, but analogous. Instead of feeding it milk, you feed it sugar-water. There are a lot of other names for it. Believed to be native to Mexico where it is said to grow naturally on Opuntia cacti.

The fermentation is done using a colony of multiple bacteria species, many of them probably Lactobacillis, and yeast, that create a gelatinous polysaccharide matrix. They look vaguely like tapioca. The clarity depends on what you have been feeding them.

Their primary food is sugar, but they are known to need minerals too. Feeding them distilled water reputedly eventually malnourishes them to death.

The interesting thing is that because of the gelatinous matrix they are relatively easy to store and transport. More interesting is the fact that the bacteria are probably probiotic. This means that if you buy probiotics like I was doing, you could save a lot of money by just drinking the cultured drink.

I THINK the bacteria produce lactic acid, which gives the drink a sour taste. Unfermented sugar, including sugar you add later, makes a sweet-and-sour drink.

Generally people do two fermentations; one to get it sour, and another one, after the gelatinous "grains" or "crystals" (they are neither) have been sieved out, flavored with other ingredients and sealed so that the carbon dioxide builds up. The result is something vaguely similar to soda pop, but without all the artificial ingredients, and with the additional boost of the probiotic content.

Also similar to something my relations in Scandinavia make. Scandinavian versions of lemonade contain a tiny amount of yeast to carbonate them.

You can use "flip top bottles", such as you can get from a brewery supply store, to do the second fermentation.

Because the liquid contains both lactobacillis and yeast, you can also make sourdough bread out of it.

You can also let some batches get good and sour, to make a substitute for vinegar out of. Different acid but comparable. Then you can use for salad dressings and household cleaning.

I'll post pix of the final product if I don't accidentally kill the colonies.

[Lady Lilya]

Yes, several of the living strains are lactobacillus ones, and produce lactic acid.

When I got my first milk kefir grains from Marilyn the KefirLady http://www.kefirlady.com/ she included lots of literature, including a list of the living cultures in both milk and water kefir.

I have seen dozens of videos about making water kefir, and have tons of friends who do it, and have never heard of a second fermentation.  It WILL continue to ferment in your fridge or on your counter.  So, if you do the main ferment on your counter, then strain it, then put it in a sealed container in the fridge, it will be fizzy when you drink it. 

Most people I know flavor their water kefir with citrus peels.  They usually put the grains and citrus peels into a "nut milk bag".  That is a fine mesh bag designed for straining nut milks (nuts blended in water).  They find this cuts down on straining time tremendously. 

All the fermented sodas I have had were just straight lactobacillus from the air.  I've had lemonade versions and ginger versions.  I want to start doing a ginger one myself.  There are tons of how-tos on the internet.

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Right now I have fermenting:
milk kefir
kombucha
cucumber pickles
sauerkraut
kimchi

Soon to come:
ginger ale
other vegetable ferments

[Ozark Lady]

I keep water kefir going.
But, I just don't like the taste of it.  I have never found a way to make it palatable.
It is excellent externally though.  And my chickens like to eat the excess grains.
I have tried various things with it, and just cannot mask the nasty taste.
So, I now have three going: with three different solutions to try to find something that is drinkable.
I need to mention that I don't like wine or beer and it tastes similar.

I like milk kefir, it is great in smoothies and in baking.

[opsec]

How would one start a batch of water kefir from scratch? Do you need to have some kind of special starter culture or do you just mix sugar and water and let it sit on your counter kind of like sourdough starter?

[Ozark Lady]

You need some starter grains.

I do have some extra ones.  If you would like to do some swapping.  I do not have any that are dried, they are actively growing, but I think they would still mail fine.

At this point, I do not have milk kefir to swap, not until the goats freshen and I start it going big time again.

[Atash Hagmahani]

Opsec, it's very interesting how it works. You keep a colony of bacteria going, that live in a gelatinous matrix that is easy to handle, store, and ship. If needed you can dry it out, reconstitute it later, and revive it. After being dried out apparently they are sluggish for a while, and sometimes are hard to get going again.

They can also be frozen for storage, then revived. Freezing apparently works better than drying.

Anyway, the colony is never used up in the process. It cultures the sugar-water, but not only isn't used up, but actually grows.

Milk kefir works the same way; the crystals or grains are not used up, so you don't have to keep buying them. Problem with milk kefir is that it wants whole milk, which is getting pricey. I don't have my own dairy animals.

OzarkLady, it seems to be a polarizing drink. Yes, it does taste a little boozy, and some people do not like the smell which reminds them of sour milk.

The first batch I made was lemon-flavored, which is a popular option, but I think the lemon turns a bit bitter with time as the lemon's own enzymes break it down.

Second batch is ginger flavored and I think that works better. The yeast by the way seem to be quite sluggish, in fact I wonder if it really actually contains any, or if the yeast are coming from added fruit. Yeast should be quite active even at the cool temperatures in my house; it should be almost explosive by now with natural carbonation, but it's not.

[opsec]

Ozark Lady,
    Thank you for the offer. I'll take you up on that, but not right now. I suspect that you are not in danger of running out of these grains anytime soon...

[Atash Hagmahani]

In hindsight:

Water kefir is rather bland. Also, contrary to numerous claims, it appears to be quite without any yeast. It's not a true "SCOBY" (Symbiotic Colony of Bacteria and Yeast). Ozarklady, this observation of mine might be climate-dependent. My house is quite chilly in winter, except when everybody's home and we turn on just enough heat to get it to 62F. It might be the most tropical ferment, probably originating in Mexico (hence alternative name "Tibicos"). However it certainly grows very fast, so I know that it's not so cold that it can't be active.

It's kinda nice to handle because the "crystals" are so tidy, but no matter how long I let it ferment, it remains fairly on the bland side, and will not turn bubbly unless you add fruit or vegetable that has yeast clinging to it. I suspect that this is the real reason that many people "feed" it raisins, which are coated with yeasts.

"Ginger Beer Plant" seems to have yeasts, but not much/many. It really has to sit a long time before it ferments enough to carbonate. Ginger Beer "Plant" is the messiest to handle. Sloppy colony that does not look very appealing at all.

So far Kombucha is by far the most "reactive" and has the most complex flavor (perhaps in part due to the tea it is traditionally "fed", but it does not end up tasting very tea-like). Turns somewhat boozey/vinagary. I add a little more sugar. This one consists of a single gelatinous "blob" floating close to the surface (some people's sink...not sure what difference is...). Kombucha seems to be a true SCOBY.

I didn't buy mine as a colony ("mushroom"), I just bought a bottle of unpasteurized Kombucha and it "took" quite fast when I fed it. The small colony that coalesced was enough to fairly quickly process a quart of sugar-water-tea.

One minor warning: one woman reportedly died, and another almost did, of acidosis from drinking it daily. Probably several times a day. I can not imagine drinking so much of it that it killed me for being too acidic but it's worth a warning. I wonder, too, just how acidic they let it get. I don't think it would be good any stronger than I allowed mine to get.

The alcohol content is only around .5% (note decimal point). But you can taste it and it tastes like wine contaminated with some lactic acid bacteria--definitely mid-way between vinegar and wine.

[Ozark Lady]

Okay, Rob, you just confirmed my recent observation.

I divided my water grains into 3 parts.
Part 1: had 3 fruits, fruit juice, egg shells, molasses and sugar all added to it.  It grew well, and was very effervescent, and very slimy... the liquid itself was slimy.  No way am I putting that in my mouth!

Part 2: had banana, applejuice, sugar and water.  It grew alot less, but was effervescent and slimy also.

Part 3: had only sugar water.  It grew (maybe?) but it was not slimy, no effervescent, so how would you know when to use it?

Does your kefir get slimy?  Mine usually does, the Part 3 is the only one that never did.  I may try that again, and if it stays not slimy, maybe taste test it?

My dislike for water kefir is not too surprising, I hate wine or beer!
But, I do like sauerkraut, vinegar, and soy sauce, so it isn't the fermenting.


The milk kefir scraps in powdered milk are doing great.  They are growing and they are now up to fermenting a quart of milk.  So, they are working, even in powdered milk!  I haven't tasted it or used them, this is an experiment.  I even neglected them, and let them set on the counter for 30 days, and they are fine!  Just hungry little kefir grains.

[Atash Hagmahani]

Not at all. Fairly clear. That's probably because I'm feeding it nothing but sugar. My guess is that other added ingredients add their own micro-organisms. "Slimey" sounds like it might have some undesireable microogranisms in it, maybe some kam yeasts or anaerobic bacteria.

I think that absent yeast (which is fairly ubiquitous on fruit and some vegetables) it should come out just less sweet than when you started, and maybe very slightly acidic, but not as sour as the GBP or Kombucha. It does not add much flavor, just a very slightly soured smell (reminds people of spoiled milk) and very slightly acidic taste. I might get different results in the summer when it's warm, but I sorta doubt it, as I have let it ferment a long time, and furthermore, it's growing very noticeably.

Be aware that one common problem is that a lot of folks are getting mixed up regarding which "critter" is which, and getting Water Kefir mixed up with GBP. GBP is sloppy. Drained people say that it looks like, ah, mucilaginous rice. It's not really "slimey" but definitely a bit repulsive-looking (not as bad to me as natto, which the Japanese eat, that does look a tad slimey/gooey...).

I have a fine seive that I use to filter it out.

[Ozark Lady]

What on earth is a GBP?

These are not slimy grains, they look like pearls?  They do discolor if I use molasses, but the others are pearly white.

The grains are not slimy in the least.

I ate a grain, and it was slightly sour, mostly tasteless, but quite firm.

Milk kefir, tastes like olives to me...

It is normal for my house to be quite warm.
In summer we only cool it down to about 90 degrees.

[Atash Hagmahani]

GBP = "Ginger Beer Plant".

It's not really a plant; it's a SCOBY (symbiotic colony of bacteria and yeast). It's the original version of Ginger Ale. You flavor the fermented drink made from it with ginger, and it's naturally effervescent and very slightly alcoholic (not even as much as Kombucha, though).

Comes from 18th-19th century UK. Died out there but survived in a German culture bank, and has been revived.

[Lady Lilya]

I plan to make ginger beer.  The recipe I intend to follow doesn't require any scoby or grains or anything like that.  It is a wild fermentation. 

[Atash Hagmahani]

Doesn't seem to be hard to do natural fermentations: Lactobacilii and yeasts seem to be ubiquitous. Trick is to keep out undesireable microogranisms, by creating environments which strongly favor the micro's you're after.

I'm going to bottle up some Kombucha and Ginger-beer today.

[silverseeds]

GBP = "Ginger Beer Plant".

It's not really a plant; it's a SCOBY (symbiotic colony of bacteria and yeast). It's the original version of Ginger Ale. You flavor the fermented drink made from it with ginger, and it's naturally effervescent and very slightly alcoholic (not even as much as Kombucha, though).

Comes from 18th-19th century UK. Died out there but survived in a German culture bank, and has been revived.

Ive never heard of this, this Id like to try... thanks for the heads up everyone...